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| Moderated by: Steve Cunningham, Stan Adams, Rod Rogers |
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| Ebay Problem | Rate Topic |
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13th, 2011 10:33 pm |
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1st Post |
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Rod Rogers Administrator 
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I'm probably out $500, but thought maybe some of you more experienced with Ebay/Paypal might have some suggestions. I purchased an item for pickup out of state. Naturally, this requires some planning & is not like running across town to pick up! I communicated with the seller, giving frequent updates as to possible trip dates, scheduling, etc. Never got a reply, so assumed they were OK with it. Just assumed they as talkative, as some are. When it came time to actually make the trip, I could not get a response to requests for directions, schedule, etc. I tried emails, Ebay messages, phone calls, etc. All calls & messages went unanswered with no VM op answering machine on their phone. The bad part is that 45 days has elapsed, and Paypal seems to have policies that let them off the hook.....tough luck I guess? If I had been more aware of the 45 day limit, I would have acted faster. Live & learn? If I dispute the Paypal charge via my credit card, would they try to charge the bank account I used for verification? Or....simply bill me again for the $500? Any suggestions from those of you more experienced with Fleabay issues?
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13th, 2011 10:54 pm |
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2nd Post |
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Ron Gibson Guest
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Call PayPal and open a claim. At least then they will try to contact the seller. If you cannot reach the seller do a charge-back through your CC. PayPal cannot come after you they will go after the seller for their money. Last edited on Wed Apr 13th, 2011 10:55 pm by Ron Gibson |
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13th, 2011 11:09 pm |
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3rd Post |
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Tom Dreesen AFCA Member 
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"PayPal cannot come after you ..." PP can do just about anything they want. Why? Because you gave them permission in those terms that nobody actually reads. So they csan swoop in and take the money from the seller ... if they choose to. After the 45 day limit suggests they won't, but you can try.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13th, 2011 11:12 pm |
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4th Post |
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Nicholas Denney Guest 
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If there are records of him scamming previously, that will at least be in your favor.
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| Posted: Wed Apr 13th, 2011 11:23 pm |
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5th Post |
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Ron Gibson Guest
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Tom Dreesen wrote: "PayPal cannot come after you ..." PayPal cannot go after Rod for doing a charge back. If they did they would lose their ability to process credit cards. They can go after the seller. Last edited on Wed Apr 13th, 2011 11:23 pm by Ron Gibson |
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 01:12 am |
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6th Post |
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Tom Dreesen AFCA Member
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All depends on how the charge went through. I haven't had a CC since 2000. 99% of the time, they side with the buyer. Last edited on Thu Apr 14th, 2011 01:14 am by Tom Dreesen |
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 01:19 am |
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7th Post |
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Steve Sherwood AFCA Member 
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I thought the you only had 30 days to make a PP claim. I doubt your credit card company will allow a charge back, because it was done through PP, but I would contact them. I had a problem a few years ago and Master Card told me that they could not do a charge back without permission from PP. EVERYONE READING THIS SHOULD BE AWARE OF THESE POLICIES BEFORE YOU CONSIDER AN E-BAY PURCHASE. This is a good example of why I don't buy or sell on e-bay anymore. Once they suck the cash from you they don't care what happens next. As for the checking account. If you have a pay pal account I would never have my main checking account on the PP account. I all ways had a separate account with usually less than than a $100 in it in case someone got access to it they could only take a small amount rather than them cleaning my main account. Good Luck Rod!!! Last edited on Thu Apr 14th, 2011 01:27 am by Steve Sherwood |
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 01:37 am |
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8th Post |
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Ron Gibson Guest
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PayPal increased the claim to 45 days a year or two ago. Even with that, if you call and press them they will usually open a claim beyond that time. Over the years I have done 3 charge backs through my CC for PayPal transactions due to not receiving items. Never had a problem. Also, the company I work for deals with about 5k CC transactions a day. We have dealt with plenty of charge backs. If a CC issuer refuses to do a charge back no matter who processed the payment report them to the actual CC company, Visa, MC etc. Many of the issuers do not want to deal with charge backs because they can lose out as well. Last edited on Thu Apr 14th, 2011 01:37 am by Ron Gibson |
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 02:06 am |
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9th Post |
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Rod Rogers Administrator
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Thanks for all the input! It sounds like a good start is to call PP & see if I can get anywhere. The seller has 100% positive feedback, so I wonder what's up. I did notice that everything they list (a lot!) is "Buy it Now". Seems funny! Rod
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 03:31 am |
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10th Post |
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Steve Stephens Guest 
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Rod, I've done a chargeback without first going through Paypal for an item that was supposed to be "like new' but was cracked and with other noticeable problems. Got all of my $17 back. Years ago I bought an ebay item and paid through PP with a credit card. Never could get a rise out of the seller by email or phone calls so left neg. FB. He started racking up about 12 negs from other people. I happened to read them and one said something about "I hope you get better soon John". The guy turned out to be in the hospital in a diabetic coma. When he got out we re-did the payment and I recieved the item. You never know what a seller's problem might be. Go the CC chargeback route as the most direct way to get your refund. Let us know if you get it.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 03:37 am |
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11th Post |
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Lewis Fitzgerald-Holland Guest 
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Steve Stephens wrote:Rod, I've done a chargeback without first going through Paypal for an item that was supposed to be "like new' but was cracked and with other noticeable problems. Got all of my $17 back. God, that's a sad story. I hope you can work it out Rod, best of luck.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 03:44 am |
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12th Post |
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Adam Rohn Guest
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Rod Rogers wrote:Thanks for all the input! It sounds like a good start is to call PP & see if I can get anywhere. Rod, as everyone else said, your fine. Just open a claim, they'll help you resolve it and you WILL get your money back. I ONLY buy off ebay from sellers that have paypal. I wouldn't worry about it being a "buy it now" auction. You paid by paypal so you'll get your money back reguardless. I actually perfer "buy it now" especially if I want/need the item now, I don't need to wait until the auction is over.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 04:01 am |
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13th Post |
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Ralph Bliss Guest 
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Adam Rohn wrote: Rod, as everyone else said, your fine. Just open a claim, they'll help you resolve it and you WILL get your money back. I ONLY buy off ebay from sellers that have paypal. I wouldn't worry about it being a "buy it now" auction. You paid by paypal so you'll get your money back reguardless. I actually perfer "buy it now" especially if I want/need the item now, I don't need to wait until the auction is over. Adam, do you want to personally guarantee he'll get his money back? Its not as simple as you think. You said "I ONLY buy off ebay from sellers that have paypal". Everyone on ebay has paypal, Ebay owns paypal.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 04:23 am |
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14th Post |
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Adam Rohn Guest
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Ralph Bliss wrote:Adam Rohn wrote:Rod, as everyone else said, your fine. Just open a claim, they'll help you resolve it and you WILL get your money back. I ONLY buy off ebay from sellers that have paypal. I wouldn't worry about it being a "buy it now" auction. You paid by paypal so you'll get your money back reguardless. I actually perfer "buy it now" especially if I want/need the item now, I don't need to wait until the auction is over. Not everyone, Ralph. Its an option but I've seen listings that don't offer paypal. Most of them do, but not all. I think its wise however because it not only saves the buyer but also the seller. I won't 100% guarntee he'll get his money back but I'm pretty confident he will, I've had to do that a few times and never once had an issue about being reimburst.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 04:37 am |
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15th Post |
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Ron Gibson Guest
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Adam, if you read the "protection" given by paypal it is only if they recover the money from the seller. If the seller has withdrawn the funds and paypal recovers nothing, the buyer gets nothing. Paypal will not come out of pocket to refund money. Always pay through paypal with a CC.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 05:05 am |
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16th Post |
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Adam Rohn Guest
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Ron Gibson wrote:Adam, if you read the "protection" given by paypal it is only if they recover the money from the seller. If the seller has withdrawn the funds and paypal recovers nothing, the buyer gets nothing. Paypal will not come out of pocket to refund money. Either way he's protected. If not by paypal, by ebay's buyer protection. I just read that if he can't resolve it through the seller and if the item qualifies for ebay buyer protection (which is always smart to buy stuff thats protected), they will refund his money plus shipping. And it would make sense that companies do anything possible to fix the problem even if its not the companies fault at all. Thats just good PR. They won't do it if it happens repeatedly but I would think most companies would want to go out and make every attempt to make the customer happy if it happens once.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 05:20 am |
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17th Post |
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Ron Gibson Guest
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Adam, these protections are a joke. They give you a false sense of security. Read through the protections and you will see e-bay and paypal have many outs to keep from having to come out of their own pocket to cover the buyer's losses. Never ever send payment through paypal using account transfers. Always pay via CC so that you can do a charge back otherwise you are taking chances.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 05:27 am |
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18th Post |
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Adam Rohn Guest
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Ron Gibson wrote:Adam, these protections are a joke. They give you a false sense of security. Read through the protections and you will see e-bay and paypal have many outs to keep from having to come out of their own pocket to cover the buyer's losses. Oh. They should change that then because it does give a false sense of security. And I never do use account tranfers when paying through paypal, I use a credit card. That way I'm covered by the bank as well.
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 05:32 am |
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19th Post |
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Lewis Fitzgerald-Holland Guest
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Adam Rohn wrote:Ron Gibson wrote: It's a nice thought that that would change , but these companies are making money off of what they do, and i doubt it's gonna change, however frustrating it is! 
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 05:36 am |
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20th Post |
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Nicholas Denney Guest
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Don't like capitalism? Neither do commies. 
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 05:39 am |
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21st Post |
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Lewis Fitzgerald-Holland Guest
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Nicholas Denney wrote:Don't like capitalism? Neither do commies. No thank you Nick, I'll stick with capitalism.  That doesn't mean I can't be fed up with Ebay's deceptive policies!
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 06:35 am |
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22nd Post |
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Rod Rogers Administrator
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OK, let's stick to the subject here & not get too political. I have to keep my threads extra clean, being a moderator & all! I am starting to think I may be best to dispute it with my CC company, too. I can talk to my banker about removing PP's access to the account I used to verify. I was afraid they'd just tap my account for the funds & I'd be no better off. I hate the way they do that.....bank account is primary, CC is backup, so I have to go in & change the payment method from the default every time. Will keep you all posted! Rod
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 06:40 am |
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23rd Post |
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Lewis Fitzgerald-Holland Guest
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Rod Rogers wrote:OK, let's stick to the subject here & not get too political. I have to keep my threads extra clean, being a moderator & all! best of luck, I certainly hope you get your money back. 
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| Posted: Thu Apr 14th, 2011 02:46 pm |
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24th Post |
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Tom Dreesen AFCA Member
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There is ALWAYS a flip side to any discussion. While this side is "problems with sellers", there is "problems with buyers" as well. Such as bogus chargebacks, bogus damage claims, etc. For every "bad" seller, there are 10 "bad" buyers. How do I know? I have bought and sold on ePay for over 10 years and have seen (or heard of from other sellers) every excuse a buyer can use to scam sellers. While you can use PP without linking to a bank account (they will cut a check), it simply isn't practical to NOT have a linked bank account if you want to accept funds. And finally, PP is not a bank and is not covered by banking laws. Either take your chances (problems are fairly rare) or don't play the game. And to put the iceing on the cake, starting on the 19th, eBay will be taking a final value fee from the SHIPPING cost!!! That should tell you where their sympathies lie ... with the stockholders and screw the sellers. Last edited on Fri Apr 15th, 2011 01:03 am by Tom Dreesen |
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15th, 2011 05:05 am |
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25th Post |
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Rod Rogers Administrator
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OK, here's the latest! I called PP, and got a gal who actually had a personality & was quite helpful. She said even tho 45 days had elapsed, she would try to contact the seller & would still file a claim against her acct. They can't force her to refund the money, but can threaten her account in a bad way. I asked about disputing the charge on my CC, and the chance that they would simply pull it from my bank acct used for PP verification. She said that it is against the law for them to do that, they can only deal with the financial inst that the original deal was on. She also said that she "couldn't advise me NOT to dispute the CC deal". I was obvious that she is NOT supposed to encourage that, but was (in her own way) telling me that it is just the thing to do! So...I called the CC and the money is being refunded to my CC acct, and removed from PP's acct. That may motivate PP to take action against the seller. I also told the PP gal that if the seller wanted to make good on the original deal & let me pick up the items, I would only pay cash after satisfactory pickup. I bought ten out of 19 items, so I'd also get to pick! Doubt it will happen, tho! Thanks for all the tips & input on this! That's what makes the AFCA great! Strength in numbers! Rod
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15th, 2011 05:13 am |
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26th Post |
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Ron Gibson Guest
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GREAT news Rod!
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15th, 2011 05:15 am |
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27th Post |
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Tom Dreesen AFCA Member
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Good luck Rod. Hope everything turns out OK.
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| Posted: Fri Apr 15th, 2011 05:29 am |
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28th Post |
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Lewis Fitzgerald-Holland Guest
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great, glad to hear it seems to be moving in a positive direction!
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16th, 2011 03:39 pm |
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29th Post |
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Rick Huckabee AFCA Member 
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I had a similar experience, although not involving that much money,Sorry! but I leazrned to screen the ,"Sellers", what do their negative feedback say? Do the complaints seem similar or realistic?Pay close attention to the Negative. and are they in the thousands of sale items? Also are they a ,"Preferred Seller",?Have to be careful.Good Luck RH.
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| Posted: Mon Apr 18th, 2011 06:43 pm |
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30th Post |
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Rod Rogers Administrator
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That's the odd thing.......100% positive feedback with 419 transactions and they have an Ebay store with quite a few items currently listed.....they look fine! I really wonder if there is a problem, health or otherwise. The gal that does the actual listing is pretty young (28), so I also wonder if there is a broken romance involved. Who knows.....I guess time will tell! Rod
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| Posted: Tue Apr 19th, 2011 07:50 pm |
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31st Post |
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Rick Huckabee AFCA Member
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Yea thats crazy , I am just very hesitant to buy off ebay anymore.good Luck RH.
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